Embrace, Extend Extinguish

[Rjack]

"Microsoft's embrace of MySQL could kill it"
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13505_3-10402551-16.html
by Matt Asay:

"For those who have fret about Microsoft fighting against open
source, I have news for you:

Microsoft's impact on open source may be worse as a friend than
as an enemy. Over the past few years, Microsoft has steadily
warmed to open source, to the point that it now hosts its own
open-source code repository and has seen its Microsoft Public
License used more often than venerable licenses like the Mozilla
Public License or the Eclipse Public License, according to new
data released by Black Duck Software.

The open-source world should be worried."


Richard Stallman and the GPL is Microsoft's best friend. Embrace,
Extend, Extinguish.

Sincerely,
Rjack

[Alan Mackenzie]

Morning, RJ!

Post by Rjack
"Microsoft's embrace of MySQL could kill it"
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13505_3-10402551-16.html
"For those who have fret about Microsoft fighting against open
Microsoft's impact on open source may be worse as a friend than
as an enemy. Over the past few years, Microsoft has steadily
warmed to open source, to the point that it now hosts its own
open-source code repository and has seen its Microsoft Public
License used more often than venerable licenses like the Mozilla
Public License or the Eclipse Public License, according to new
data released by Black Duck Software.
The open-source world should be worried."

I agree completely. Any open-source or free software project that gets
into bed with MS is doomed. The theme is nothing new - Faust made a pact
with Microsoft several hundred years ago, and paid with his soul.

Why should Microsoft's way of squashing competition from free software be
essentially different from from proprietary software?

Allowing MS to contribute to free software, as the Linux project has
done, is hopefully a different matter. At least Linux has big legal guns
behind it, if needed.

Post by Rjack
Sincerely,
Rjack

[Hyman Rosen]

Post by Rjack
The open-source world should be worried.

I'll start worrying when we see an actual example of
"extinguish" when it comes to MS's support of open
source or free software.

[Rjack]

Post by Hyman Rosen

Post by Rjack
The open-source world should be worried.

I'll start worrying when we see an actual example of
"extinguish" when it comes to MS's support of open source or
free software.

Due to legal antitrust concerns, Microsoft is always going to
allow about 20% of the total market to competitors. What
Microsoft is extinguishing is any hope of any new competitors
ever threating their 80% share of the market. The past fifteen
years have established this fact beyond immediate question. The
path of computer software history is littered with the bones of
organizations who challenged Microsoft. Richard Stallman and
"Free" software are unwitting dupes in this ongoing saga of
Microsoft dominance. Nothing -- I repeat nothing -- but a
proprietary software company will ever threaten Microsoft's iron
hand in the marketplace. Anti-capitalist open source is a
monopolist's software dream.

Dedicate even half of Linux's developer resources to hardware
drivers for FreeBSD and then sit back and watch some upstart
proprietary company give Microsoft sufficient real competition to
lower consumer prices. It's either that or mindlessly continue to
develop more anti-capitalist software while the status quo rolls
on for another decade.

Sincerely,
Rjack

[Alan Mackenzie]

Post by Rjack
The open-source world should be worried.

I'll start worrying when we see an actual example of "extinguish"
when it comes to MS's support of open source or free software.

Due to legal antitrust concerns, Microsoft is always going to allow
about 20% of the total market to competitors. What Microsoft is
extinguishing is any hope of any new competitors ever threating their
80% share of the market.

A bit like IBM before them, you mean.

The past fifteen years have established this fact beyond immediate
question. The path of computer software history is littered with the
bones of organizations who challenged Microsoft. Richard Stallman and
"Free" software are unwitting dupes in this ongoing saga of Microsoft
dominance. Nothing -- I repeat nothing -- but a proprietary software
company will ever threaten Microsoft's iron hand in the marketplace.

Nothing will threaten MS's dominance in the corporate desktop
marketplace, just like nothing could threaten IBM's in the mainframe
market. Who, exactly, needs a mainframe? Who, in a few years, will need
a desktop PC?

Anti-capitalist open source is a monopolist's software dream.

That might well be the case. Not sure who's doing the dreaming though.
I'm not aware of any existing "anti-capitalist open source".

Dedicate even half of Linux's developer resources to hardware
drivers for FreeBSD ....

Rjack, why do you think developers prefer writing for Linux than
\(Free\|Open\|Net\)BSD?

.... and then sit back and watch some upstart proprietary company give
Microsoft sufficient real competition to lower consumer prices.

That company is Google.

It's either that or mindlessly continue to develop more anti-capitalist
software while the status quo rolls on for another decade.
Sincerely,
Rjack

[Hyman Rosen]

Microsoft is always going to allow about 20%

It doesn't surprise me at all that you inhabit
conspiracy space, where companies "allow" things.
Watch out for those black helicopters!

[amicus_curious]

Post by Rjack
Due to legal antitrust concerns, Microsoft is always going to
allow about 20% of the total market to competitors...

As romantic as that may sound, it is the wrong view of the situation.
Microsoft's continued dominance of the PC OS market is due to tried and true
notions of market dynamics, nothing more and nothing less. The PC market,
as orchestrated by Microsoft, is mature as such things go and already they
are branching out into other fields in order to find new worlds to conquer.
The PC OS market is very mature and consumer expectations, attitudes, and
tastes are firmly set. There is no way on earth to unseat Microsoft here
and there is little reason to do so. The FOSS fellas are miffed at the
market success and vast wealth of the MSFT founders, but they are fated to
be miffed for all time.

New things come up all the time, for example Google and Facebook and such.
They are the star performers today and will likely pale in the future to be
replaced by something else. It is nature's way and read of "Product Life
Cycles" in the marketing lore for the details.

[Rjack]

Post by amicus_curious

Post by Rjack
Due to legal antitrust concerns, Microsoft is always going
to allow about 20% of the total market to competitors...

As romantic as that may sound, it is the wrong view of the
situation. Microsoft's continued dominance of the PC OS market
is due to tried and true notions of market dynamics, nothing
more and nothing less.

Microsoft would crush Linux (and probably Apple) with software
patent litigation if the D.O.J. antitrust division weren't
hovering about.

Post by amicus_curious
The PC market, as orchestrated by Microsoft, is mature as such
things go and already they are branching out into other
fields in order to find new worlds to conquer. The PC OS
market is very mature and consumer expectations, attitudes,
and tastes are firmly set. There is no way on earth to unseat
Microsoft here and there is little reason to do so.

Something like OS X running on cheap Intel hardware would be a
terrible threat to Microsoft's desktop. Apple would never allow
this to happen though. Apple's hardware is the most overpriced
scam on the market. Apple leverages it operating system on it's
outrageously priced hardware -- it works in their business model
but could potentially pose a real threat to Microsoft's desktop
running on affordable hardware.

Post by amicus_curious
The FOSS fellas are miffed at the market success and vast
wealth of the MSFT founders, but they are fated to be miffed
for all time.
New things come up all the time, for example Google and
Facebook and such. They are the star performers today and will
likely pale in the future to be replaced by something else.
It is nature's way and read of "Product Life Cycles" in the
marketing lore for the details.

Sincerely,
Rjack

[amicus_curious]

Post by Rjack

Post by amicus_curious

Due to legal antitrust concerns, Microsoft is always going to allow
about 20% of the total market to competitors...

As romantic as that may sound, it is the wrong view of the situation.
Microsoft's continued dominance of the PC OS market
is due to tried and true notions of market dynamics, nothing more and
nothing less.

Microsoft would crush Linux (and probably Apple) with software
patent litigation if the D.O.J. antitrust division weren't
hovering about.

Not very likely. There is nothing to be gained in doing that. Microsoft is
a business and a successful one at that. They are well advised by the best
graduates of HBS and Stanford and are not likely to make many business
mistakes. Their market is theirs to have and hold as long as it lasts.
That is not to say that PC software markets will not decline over time as
they become saturated with prior art, but as long as there is a buck to be
made, it will be Microsoft's buck.

Post by Rjack

Post by amicus_curious
The PC market, as orchestrated by Microsoft, is mature as such
things go and already they are branching out into other
fields in order to find new worlds to conquer. The PC OS
market is very mature and consumer expectations, attitudes,
and tastes are firmly set. There is no way on earth to unseat
Microsoft here and there is little reason to do so.

Something like OS X running on cheap Intel hardware would be a
terrible threat to Microsoft's desktop. Apple would never allow
this to happen though. Apple's hardware is the most overpriced
scam on the market. Apple leverages it operating system on it's
outrageously priced hardware -- it works in their business model
but could potentially pose a real threat to Microsoft's desktop
running on affordable hardware.

Apple is a niche player in a very comfortable niche and, as you note, they
are not likely to open it up to the low price producers to allow a price war
to develop. Microsoft will leave them alone and they will leave Microsoft
alone.

Post by Rjack

Post by amicus_curious
The FOSS fellas are miffed at the market success and vast
wealth of the MSFT founders, but they are fated to be miffed
for all time.
New things come up all the time, for example Google and Facebook and
such. They are the star performers today and will
likely pale in the future to be replaced by something else. It is
nature's way and read of "Product Life Cycles" in the marketing lore for
the details.

Sincerely,
Rjack